...with field approvals practially non-existent, then (in general),
how does a person go about aquiring (holding) an STC for a modification?
Jim
STC's
Sheesh.....
http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guida ... C21-40.pdf
Can you say HEADACHE ?
Hasta ~
Bob K.
Anchorage, AK[/i]
http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guida ... C21-40.pdf
Can you say HEADACHE ?
Hasta ~
Bob K.
Anchorage, AK[/i]
I also have a Cherokee. Several years ago, I bought a new STC extended baggage compartment for the lower floor of the Cherokee. It was simple and straight forward.
Essentially, it just blocked off 1/2 of the lower floor with an access door/doubler in the existing floor. No increase in baggage weight. I think I was the first to buy the STC. When talking to the developer of the STC, he said it cost him $20,000 for the STC.
Think about it, $20,000 to block off an area and add a door with no change in loading or aerodynamics or horse power.
That is why there are no new STCs. Good thing Edison did not have to get STCs or we would still be using smoke signals.
Dennis
Essentially, it just blocked off 1/2 of the lower floor with an access door/doubler in the existing floor. No increase in baggage weight. I think I was the first to buy the STC. When talking to the developer of the STC, he said it cost him $20,000 for the STC.
Think about it, $20,000 to block off an area and add a door with no change in loading or aerodynamics or horse power.
That is why there are no new STCs. Good thing Edison did not have to get STCs or we would still be using smoke signals.
Dennis
STC
I am glad to see someone actually research getting an STC. Good for you! Now with that bit of knowledge it isn't hard to see why that new little "Do-Dad" costs so much is it.
We have approximately 25 STCs, 19 supplements to our PMA plus 6 Engineering Design Approvals.
We just acquired another STC and the PMA letter has been sent out. We should receive the letter (supplement to original PMA Letter) in a few days.
We still have 17 STC applications that are active in the Anchorage ACO for various aircraft including Champs, Chiefs, Sedan, Cessna 170/180/182/185. We even make parts for Taylorcraft.
All this is in addition to all the new data, parts, pieces, etc. that we are adding to the original Sedan data to make the plane more useful, fun and worth owning.
I am not complaining at all here; this is what I have chosen to do for a living and I love it. Heck, I'm just a new kid on the block by some of my peers standards. Atlee Dodge retired with over 150 STCs. I learned a lot from Atlee and others like him; and I'm still learning!
I'm glad that there is an appreciation of my and other STC Holder's efforts. It helps make it all worth while.
Blue Skies and a fair tailwind to you all,
Burl
We have approximately 25 STCs, 19 supplements to our PMA plus 6 Engineering Design Approvals.
We just acquired another STC and the PMA letter has been sent out. We should receive the letter (supplement to original PMA Letter) in a few days.
We still have 17 STC applications that are active in the Anchorage ACO for various aircraft including Champs, Chiefs, Sedan, Cessna 170/180/182/185. We even make parts for Taylorcraft.
All this is in addition to all the new data, parts, pieces, etc. that we are adding to the original Sedan data to make the plane more useful, fun and worth owning.
I am not complaining at all here; this is what I have chosen to do for a living and I love it. Heck, I'm just a new kid on the block by some of my peers standards. Atlee Dodge retired with over 150 STCs. I learned a lot from Atlee and others like him; and I'm still learning!
I'm glad that there is an appreciation of my and other STC Holder's efforts. It helps make it all worth while.
Blue Skies and a fair tailwind to you all,
Burl
When all else fails, go to the source. Factory Approved parts and data will get you back in the air.
I'm STILL waiting for approval to use the approved pop rivets in my .032 Champ wings in accordance with SL 85. Good thing I don't need them right now but it has been probably 6 months since the paperwork (337) was sent in. I can't imagine how anyone can justify tying up someone's equipment for such a long time.
Mike Berg
Mike Berg
"If God had intended man to fly He would have given us more money"
The field approval process is not entirely dead. I've gotten 3 or 4 in the last couple years. The right AI with the right relationships is crucial. My last attempt - to use PK screws instead of nails to attach my ribs to my new spars - took all of 30 minutes....
Minor alterations are also sometimes a viable option, and using a slightly different rivet is, in my non-AI-having opinion, a good candidate. Asking approval for something that's already implicitly granted doesn't make much sense to me.
Minor alterations are also sometimes a viable option, and using a slightly different rivet is, in my non-AI-having opinion, a good candidate. Asking approval for something that's already implicitly granted doesn't make much sense to me.
Had phone conversation with a knowledgable IA the other day and he said (in short) it looks to him like a field approval is not even necessary as basically the fabric is being attached to the ribs by an already approved factory method with the approved rivets. So in effect, the attachment method just becomes part of the covering process of the STC.
Well, you try to do things "right" and I was told by a couple of IA's that approval was necessary so there you go. My IA fully agrees with me but somewhere down the line another IA might do an annual or the plane is sold and question the attachment method and the plane is tied up again.
I know common sense will eventually prevail. Just might take awhile yet and having a 337 on record might help our someone else on this forum when it comes time to rebuild their wings.
Mike Berg
Well, you try to do things "right" and I was told by a couple of IA's that approval was necessary so there you go. My IA fully agrees with me but somewhere down the line another IA might do an annual or the plane is sold and question the attachment method and the plane is tied up again.
I know common sense will eventually prevail. Just might take awhile yet and having a 337 on record might help our someone else on this forum when it comes time to rebuild their wings.
Mike Berg
"If God had intended man to fly He would have given us more money"
Common sense can not prevail as long as we're encouraging the FAA to say "no" by asking every time we want to do something that we've clearly already been given permission for.
The theoretical other future AI is an idiot and nobody should care what he'll think. He should be able to read a log book as well as a 337. If it's approved now, under whatever method, it's approved. You're never married to the last AI on the planet; there are always options.
The theoretical other future AI is an idiot and nobody should care what he'll think. He should be able to read a log book as well as a 337. If it's approved now, under whatever method, it's approved. You're never married to the last AI on the planet; there are always options.