New 7EC

[Paul Agaliotis]

I,ll bet you a ride in an Aeronca that ACA will find a way to get the 7LSA klunker to the experimental show in Oshkosh.
The exposure at the NAA show was too small for them to attend. It,s all about the money.
Paul

[gusc]

Jerry,

Surely you must know that Piper does not sell Cubs of any kind and hasn't for many years.

They don't even have a high wing plane anymore!

[jerrymjr]

You missed my point.

...and I deleted my post to show it.
You guys can just flame away in here. I am done with it.

[bwmatz]

Ok folks...let's give Jerry a little break here. He's been a great participant on this forum and we want him to stay. It wasn't HIS decision not to bring the 7LS to Middletown, so don't shoot the messenger. What happened is done, let's move on shall we?

[gusc]

Brian,

I didn't notice anywhere that Jerry was flamed by anyone. Most comments were about ACA, not him? I think he is being a little sensitive here.

I went back and read all the posts and his point escapes me?

[joea]

Gus,

Agree and believe that everyone knows that Jerry Jr is not the person who makes the decisions in this area and as well he is/was brave enough to continue this discussion when things started looking bad.

Jerry,

I feel that no one had any bad feelings about you personally but no one liked that the National fly-in for all Aeronca's (where the ACA airplane was derived from in the first place) was just pooh-pooh'ed as being too small before anyone even knew what the attendance would be. In the end it was larger than we expected and was well worth a dealer or ACA bringing an airplane to the show. Jody said that he heard from upwards of 15 people interested in buying a plane at the show and its difficult to buy when there is nothing to show.

I do believe that Jerry knows the right people to talk to about this and that either they told him to stop bothering them and to go back to his DER work or that its none of his business. Well, its his and every other employe's business at ACA IMHO.

Either way it does not help ACA and it does not help sell airplanes. When the Ohio dealer did not to return Jerry's or Brian's emails then its pretty clear that they are not hungry enough to be selling airplanes. I just hope that ACA finds someone in the area who is "hungry" and wants to sell product more than the present dealer.

We really appreciate your input on the forum and want to see you stick around. That said, for you to continue in your job, ACA needs to sell airplanes to keep you employed. From where I stand, someone at ACA and the Ohio dealer are not doing their job and for your sake, and the sake of the other active employes at ACA, I hope you guys can find the problem and turn it around.

[Paul Agaliotis]

I can be a little direct in my response. If you feel this was an attack on you,Jerry, I am sorry.
Just so you know, out in the field, we have LSA distributors cramming their planes down our throat. Right now we have some kind of European water drop with wings on line to see how it fits our LSA needs.
If ACA is satisfied with the market share, and is adding a new model line, the market will accept it. If ACA plans to be a major player in the LSA movement they need to act.
Paul

[Captgrumps]

Paul

The real LSA market will be old Aeronca, Pipers, T-Craft, Erocoupes and etc., that the average person can afford if they want. The new LSA market is a high priced market for very little more airplane that only some of the well healed can afford as a toy. Afterall that is what they are, a toy that fullfills the dream of man making like a bird.

Sorry I didn't make th fly-in with my '39 Chief--it is receiving some catch up items needing work that the last owner A&P/IA failed to find. But the log books looked great . No big deal, I bought it sight unseen over the phone and figured for the price I could put my A&P/IA license to work--it won't be the first time in the past 50 years. Never expect the best, but hope for it.

I am looking for a Chief control wheel to replace the go-cart control wheel the past owner put in it. I have one, need one more. Prewar of postwar--doesn't matter.

Doug

[joea]

Doug,

If its keeping you from flying, I have a set of post-war Chief control yokes. Not sure if they are what you are looking for nor if they wil work. Do not really want to get rid of them but hate to see someone on the ground either.

Email me when you get a chance. Am heading out tomorro to my HS reunion this weekend in the Mid-West but will be on email most of the time.

Joe A

[Paul Agaliotis]

Glad to see you got the Chief home Doug. It will fly rings around a 11AC.
The LSA market seems to have two types of pilots. The first being the mature pilots that are in fear of the medical exam. They tend to be drawn to the 7AC. The second is the new pilots that are satisfied flying under the Sport pilot rules, but, want to fly a new airplane. Even with the cost of the rental doubled, the new starts will fly the new LSA models.
With the retro craze in full swing, I think a retro Champ would do well.
I understand the caution ACA is using and hope they are just slow in leaving and not stuck in the gate.
Paul

[David Johnson]

Gentlemen, Please, Please, let's go back to the positive, all for one-one for all attitude that made me want to be a part of this wonderful community. We have a great group of guys and gals. Pilots tend to be people who get things done, by their nature. This also makes us very direct sometimes. It has been something that has caused me problems before, personally. Jerry, I appreciate your input on this forum and others. I was at the factory buying some wings and other parts a while back for a Citabria, everyone treated me great! I am proud we have the only light plane line that is still being produced! We need you guys to do good and stay in business! I have both Champs and Citabrias. Hope to play with a Decathlon sometime too, when money permits. Jerry does this out of the goodness of his heart, he does not have to help us! Jerry is in a business, his decisions are made in that light. I run a small business, my decisions are all about priority. Note also this is a family business. You could get real close to his feelings by being negative about any part of it. He has to work with his dealers, even if he does not agree with them. I appreciate every one of you, and hope this is taken the way it is intended. Let's put this behind us and go forward. With a positive attitude, Sincerely, David Johnson

[MikeB]

I don't know: regarding the LSA market, $50-90,000 is still out of the range of what I'd pay for an adult 'toy'. I'm sure they (LSA people) must have done a analysis, but I find it hard to believe that there would be that big of a market. We all like to look and dream (I do that at Oshkosh every year) but when it gets down to spending our financial future the purse strings get a lot tighter. On the other hand, when I see these huge motor homes going down the road, I figure the owners probably aren't living on teacher's retirement either (or else they don't have a house to live in). I was raised in a pretty conservative family(dad: farmer and factory worker) and you didn't buy anything unless you could justify it.

But then, I'm more of a "tinkerer" than a "flyer".

I kind of thought Jerry was getting beat up too much, also.

Mike

[gusc]

I think Paul covered the whole thing in very few words (Hooray).

I'm and old duffer and I sure wouldn't pay almost $100K for any airplane and certainly not a LSA. I love my 7AC and it cost me ten times what my first one cost. My Navion Rangemaster was a XC whiz but I didn't pay nearly the price of a new 7EC for it either.

On the other hand younger guys think nothing of spending a lot of money on a car or airplane. The prices of new cars shock me but it doesn't faze my kids or grandkids! Actually, new cars are kind of boring to me and so are new airplanes, but most people seem to prefer new.

I went back again and read the posts but all I found were positive comments and I never did see any in which Jerry was getting beat up. Being disgusted with the attitude of ACA management is no reflection on Jerry.

It is good business to cater to oldtimers even if there is no immediate monetary gain, goodwill is a valuable business asset.

[jc pacquin]

Jerry knows, or he had better know that dealing with the public is not easy. If he is sensitive to criticism, then hes in the wrong business. Especially if its justified. As Mike said, you start talking 60-90 grand then you'd better show up and be looking GOOD! This IS a toy type aircraft and to most of us its big money for hopping around here and there for a hamburger. Personally if I were going to (or could) go for this kind of money, I'd hop in a 60,000.00,used Citabria, 150 hp and get on with it. Over 50 grand and your into some very nice, PERFORMING type aircraft. A local fellow just bought a very nice Husky, low time, 180 hp, like new for 80 grand. Jerry might ,and I hope he has, shown these emails to the big cheese at the company, the guy who made the wrong decision. I dont see where anyone has been unkind or unfair to Jerry. They simply have stated the facts as they occured.

[MikeB]

I think we should just drop the subject.

The only point I was trying to make was I can't justify spending that much $$$$$ on a airplane and I'm perfectly happy with my old Champ...........it's a sweetheart. By the way, I made three rear seat solo takeoffs and landings in it today. Well, the first was sort of an "arrival" (forgot to look where the ground was), but the last two were greasers. The biggest difference I found was that I kept reaching behind the seat for the carb heat .