National Aeronca Association Bulletin Board

I would like to put a bigger engine in my 7AC. Can anyone tell me if c85-12 with a starter (stec or similar) is approved and will it fit on the exsisting 65-8 mount. Folks around here are getting very nervous about hand propping and it is getting more and more difficult to find someone to give you a flip or sit in the cockpit. As mentioned in previous posts it's hard to find something to tie the tail to on some ramps. If all this is possible where would I get the STC.
Thanks
Ken Patry

Ken,
The engine can be installed with a log entry when performed via a Service Letter. The rub comes with the electrical system installation. The FEDs can't come to any kind of standardization for it. If you install the electrical system you will also need a transponder. Some have used a total loss system for starting with some success and by-pass the TPX requirement. Careful with the system installation because when ADS-B kicks in you will need 10K to 15K of required equipment to fly.
Paul

Paul,
Thanks for the info. first off, I'm in Canada, and what goes there in the USA, is usually accepted up here. I'm not quite sure what you mean by total loss system, is it just a starter with a battery, no Generator? I don't want to get into Transponders etc, so the total loss system would be oaky with me. Also what is ADS-B, not sure if that would apply here. Once I get enough info, I'll take it to our local Transport office and see what they have to say.
Thanks again
Ken Patry

That's correct Ken,
A starter and a battery which will be charged on an as needed situation. Doug Coombs at the Luscombe ( what ever they call it today) site has a nice installation with paperwork that might work for you.
Paul

Thanks Paul,
I'll talk to Doug Coombs and check it out.
Thanks again, appreciate it.
Ken

Don't think ADS-B will be anytime soon. ATC is not progressing very fast from what I hear and there is opposition to the cost. For local low level flying from a private field I don't think they could even monitor it. Could be an issue at those paved strips that get government money.

Doug

Doug,
That's exactly the problem I see. ADS-B could be the end of many GA operations. At this time the equipment needed, costs more than the value of my plane. Here in the big hangar we are proceeding with the installation of the equipment and systems. I get a feeling it's closer than we think.
Paul

Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe you need a transponder if you stay out of the required area. When I had my Cherokee I spent enough money keeping it (transponder) legal that I could have bought it again a couple of times over. I don't think a 'total loss' system could support both a transponder and a mounted com set and be reliable.

MikeB

Mike,
The ASI confirmed during my facility records check, if you have an electrical system you need a transponder.
The total loss system is not considered an electrical system. You need a storage device a charging device, electrical loads and the associated wiring to be a system
Paul

That's interesting. I always thought if you stayed out of the "veil" a transponder wasn't needed. It might have started out that way when the 30 mile veil was established way back when and these things have a way of evolving as time goes on. Anyway, I sold the Cherokee and my L16 will have a total loss system so it's not an issue for me. Basically with all the new requirements that pop up from time to time they're going to force the little guy (GA as you said) out of cross country flying in a few years.

MikeB

Ken,

I know of a lot of Aeronca owners with a "total loss" system and they love it. Usually end up charging the battery every month or so and even then its not down that far, they just feel better doing it.

Get a Skytec or B&C geared starter and it works like a charm.

Joe A

Paul, what class airspace are you in? The way I have understood the regs is class C requires a transponder in an "electric" plane, class D does not.

Thanks everyone,
Joe, I will go with the total loss system for sure, I don't think I have to worry about a Transponder where I live for quite some time. From what I read here there is no problem installing a c85-12 engine in a 7AC, is that correct? Also does anyone have a good source for a C85-12.
Thanks
Ken Patry

Ken,
They (85/12) pop up on Barnstormers and EBAY once in awhile. I looked for one quite a while for my L16 project and finally decided to bite the bullet and put a 0200 in with the Wagner STC using a Sky-Tec starter and total loss system. Most of the 85/12's I inquired about or looked at were over priced for the condition or they were 'newly overhauled' and experimental with no documentation. As one who got 'burned' on a 'overhauled to zero specifications by a certified IA' once I think I learned something the first time.

MikeB

Mike,
The 0200 conversion sounds good, does it require any rework of the cowlings? Also is there any paper work, info available for the Battery instalation for the total loss system.
Thanks
Ken