11CC Chief

Post-War Aeronca Chief airplanes
MikeB
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11CC Chief

Post by MikeB »

The L16 has been done for a couple of years and I've apparently been moping around home. My wife said " I think you need another project". Hmmm! Does that sound like an invitation?? So today I went and looked at a 11CC Chief/85 horse. Wings have been covered and signed off. The rest isn't bad but think I would recover the fuselage and tail feathers, anyway. New Slick mags, carb rebuilt ($700), interior decent, new windshield, a bunch of new parts, etc. Of course the logs have been lost but pretty much reconstructed through FAA records. This thing has some possiblities. The bad news: side by side, no sticks and at 1350# not light sport. Oh! and it's not a Champ :cry: but it might have to do :wink: . Stay tuned.......

MikeB
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rkittine
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by rkittine »

Mike, Its an Air-Knocker and you will have a lot of fun with it. I have one of each and like my Chief for certain things better than the Champ and Vice Versa. Look forward to seeing your progress. - Bob
Robert P. Kittine, Jr.WA2YDV
West Nyack Aviation, L.L.C.
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Paul Agaliotis
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by Paul Agaliotis »

Mike,
Put the thing in Utility category. The weight comes down to 1290 and should qualify.
Paul
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MikeB
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by MikeB »

Paul: that's possible????
Mike
Paul Agaliotis
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by Paul Agaliotis »

Mike,
I don't see why it wouldn't. The limit for operations is 1320lbs for the Sport Pilot and the max weight for the 11CC in Utility is 1290lbs. You'll need to have the Flight Manual (required to be carried in this plane) and placard it accordingly in the correct category.
Paul
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MikeB
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by MikeB »

I noticed the flight manual lists 'utility' a 1290#. If it works, great!

I'm probably going to pick the 'Super Chief" up if we can get the state registration up to date but that's the sellers problem. It orginally came out of an estate sale. Anyway, I've had my eye on this for some time and looking forward to starting on it. Aeroncas shouldn't be gathering dust and rusting away in a garage.

Mike
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by Paul Agaliotis »

Mike,
I'm working on a couple of registrations that had been removed from the data base. It's pretty tough to get them reinstated. The FAA made a process to remove them but has no process to put them back. I sent a bunch of information yesterday and I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
Make sure the registration is clean AND transferable.
Paul
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joea
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by joea »

Good to see Mike and great idea Paul!

Please let us know how it goes with the paperwork.
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by EDGEFLY »

MikeB,

I also think Paul has a great idea there. When I was "Chief-hunting" a couple of years ago, it came to my attention that CC's in the Utility Category may not be operated with Aux fuel or Baggage(according to the Flight Manual). Depending on your own particular mission, this may or may not be significant. In any event, I'm hoping you make the Chief plunge. We need more members to be active on this forum flying Hi-Speed Aeroncas !

Dale
MikeB
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by MikeB »

I've been searching through the records and the present owner has done a title search through AOPA which came through 'clean' as best I can figure out. He owns it according the FAA records and is still 'tri annually' registered until 2014. So that leaves the state registration which does concern me as I think a previous owner bought it off EBAY (???) and started the resurrection, passed away and it came up on an estate sale where the present owner bought it. I 'suspect' neither of these owners registered it with the state as I can't find any completed registration copies. Pretty sure the state would want their registration and sales tax due.

Looks like the last time it flew was 1996 so that's alot of internal 'sit time' on the engine which may or may not be a factor in the decision process along with the fact I don't intend to sell the L16 so this would wind up needing to be sold again at some time in the future. To be decided, I guess......

Mike
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Richard Murray
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by Richard Murray »

MikeB,

How bad is the sales tax in WI? OH charges between 6% and 7% depending on the county, however they have let airplane sales pass exempt if you call it a casual sale between individuals. The important part is to be sure you are buying it from an individual in our case.

We also avoid state registration if the aircraft is not airworthy. A small charge of $15/seat is all the annual registration costs in OH. What do they charge in WI?

Richard
Richard
MikeB
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by MikeB »

Richard,
Wisconsin sales tax (with county) is 5.5% if I remember correctly. It can be registered after 35 years as an antique with a $50 lifetime registration fee instead of the current two year on newer A/C. I'm unsure if one would want to register it as 'unairworthy' as I suspect it might get the feds involved to get it reapproved. I've never done that but just paid the $50 even if I was doing a five year restoration. If I do pull the trigger on this one I'd probably be looking at a 2-3 year process as I tend to work when I have the time although there is a lot already done on this project. My shop is 50 feet from the house so it's nice to have something to do when the snow is flying and the wind is blowing.
Mike
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rkittine
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by rkittine »

I always set up an L.L.C. for each of my planes. Reduces Liability along with eliminating the sales tax if you register in Delaware. I tried the restriction of category with the feds for getting something to qualify as an LSA and they would not buy it. There are issues with MAXIMUM TAKEOFF WEIGHT, that they brought up rather than maximum gross weight - Operating - and that if a plane is certificated in on category, you can not down grade it, but maybe your FSDO will see it differently. It is more the Insurance Company that I am concerned about, i.e. maybe not honoring a claim on some technicality. I also tried something like this with a 7DC. With No Bounce Gear, you could, at your option increase the maximum takeoff and gross weight to 1350, causing it not to qualify as an LSA. Once you did it, you could not bring it back according to three FSDOs. I even offered to remove the No-Bounce Gear and install the normal gear and was told that this was not allowed either. Lastly I tried to get away with my Luscombe on 1400 floats being reclassed as to limit the max gross weight based on normal verses utility class as on 1400s the MGW is increased to 1470, over the 1430 max on floats. The feds would not allow me to do this. Will be interesting to hear how you make out.

Regards, Bob
Robert P. Kittine, Jr.WA2YDV
West Nyack Aviation, L.L.C.
New York, New York 631-374-9652
rkittine@aol.com
7ECjim
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by 7ECjim »

Since this a active Chief topic, how about chief with a 115hp Lycoming. Done Buzz wagner stc GW staying at 1250 empty weight is 810 is that common for chief weights???? I know my 100hp champ was 853 empty.
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joea
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Re: 11CC Chief

Post by joea »

Robert,

"No Bounce gear" is not used on the Chiefs, never seen one using them.

I use a private trust for my higher value items. For what Mike is doing here I would tell them that the plane is "undergoing restoration" and thus not airworthy at this time.

Joe A
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