Hydraulic disc brakes

[Paul Agaliotis]

Richard,
I dont have a copy of it, but, nobody else does either. The Service Letter could ease the issue with the FAA about the modification, since the factory did this alteration and generated Approved Data.
I just took the time to read the 337 posted. I knew that airplane when Keven owned it. It was red and cream at the time. And had a Lycoming on it.
See you at Middletown.
Paul

[MikeB]

I've always wondered with hydraulic brakes might be 'too good' and cause a nose over if applied in a panic (deer appears on the runway, etc.). Reading Gus's posting he says with heel brakes they take a lot of pressure so maybe not. Anyway, I don't have a problem with mechanical brakes either: I have GY on my L16 and also had them on my 7AC. The Chief has toe Van Sickles ....should be interesting on the first flight . I was able to purchase pretty much a complete set of GY (disks, wheels, clips, etc.) so I should be set there for awhile. I guess wheel cracking with the VS in particular is the reason folks want to convert and I can see that, too.

Hoping to make Middletown this year Paul and I'll buy you a 'frosty one'.

Mike Berg

[Paul Agaliotis]

Mike,
Good brakes can be a bad thing with these little airplanes. I try to stay away from them on landing and use them for run-up only. Many times people will convert to another brake to make up for bad tailwheel steering.
The Goodyear are fine brakes. But are getting tough to find parts and are costly when found.
It will be great to see you at Middletown.
Paul

[Richard Murray]

Paul,

It is still red and cream. I tried to buy it when it was salvaged in California and was outbid. Then I tried to buy it the next year when it was salvaged again in Nebraska. Finally I bid less than I did on each of the previous two attempts and won the award in Michigan. The fellow whose strip it was at said the brakes were rather ineffective when the pedal was depressed. The conversion does offer an option to many other wheels that are easier to find and less expensive.

Richard hoping I can fly the Champ to Middletown this year.

[Paul Agaliotis]

Richard,
It would be great to see you again. Our last visit was much too short. I've got some updates on some of the FAA proceedures on all of these "salvage",and "destroyed" airplanes.
Paul

[Richard Murray]

Another 337 on hydraulic brakes. This one is from Sam Burke.

[MikeB]

I like the part "installed by person known" Seems a lot of old airplanes have those 'features'. One of mine 'grew a big dorsal fin' at some time in it's life.

Mike

[MikeB]

I like the part "installed by person unknown" Seems a lot of old airplanes have those 'features'. One of mine 'grew a big dorsal fin' at some time in it's life.

Mike

[gusc]

I've always wondered with hydraulic brakes might be 'too good' and cause a nose over if applied in a panic (deer appears on the runway, etc.). Reading Gus's posting he says with heel brakes they take a lot of pressure so maybe not. Anyway, I don't have a problem with mechanical brakes either: I have GY on my L16 and also had them on my 7AC. The Chief has toe Van Sickles ....should be interesting on the first flight . I was able to purchase pretty much a complete set of GY (disks, wheels, clips, etc.) so I should be set there for awhile. I guess wheel cracking with the VS in particular is the reason folks want to convert and I can see that, too.

Hoping to make Middletown this year Paul and I'll buy you a 'frosty one'.

Mike Berg

I have a few of those clips somewhere if anyone gets into a bind. My Stinson had GY floating disc brakes and they worked fine once I drilled out the flanges and used buttons to hold the clips.

Those pucks do cost a fortune but should last forever on a light Champ/Chief.

The biggest problem I had was the pucks wore unevenly but I learned to reverse and/or grind them true for a bit more life. Also I learned to shim with the thinner worn pucks!

I had the big tail Stinson and it was a bear to taxi in a X/wind and wore out brakes, otherwise it didn't need brakes often with those big flaps.

[MikeB]

Gus
My old Champ (still on our airport) had the clips that just pushed in over the projection on the wheel. I found out the best way to keep them from popping out was to use silicone to 'stick them'. I think once parts wear a bit and the disk gets a chance to flop around it tends to kick the clips out. I also found out that some 4 wheeler (maybe Artic Cat??) used pucks that could be modified for the Good Years. I really don't have any problem with the Good Year heels once you learn their limitations and get used to them but your point regarding the pinned clips is well taken.
Mike

[bob turner]

Our old Stinson 108-5 had Clevelands. We loved them.

I don't think the power of the brakes is what causes nose-overs. I think it is the sudden application of full brake at very low speeds.

It took me 50 years to figure that out. I have only had one nose-over, and it was when a student jumped on both brakes in a J-4 in a moment of panic at about eight knots. But we are seeing a lot of them - tower says "can you makeCharlie?" The answer is "sure," followed by heavy braking at low speed and a prop turned into toothpicks.

So, no - get good disc brakes, and pay attention to how you jump on them. Never apply full, sudden brake pressure at low speed.

Opinion.